Ojo Taylor: I think it might be fair to say that most people think of you in a musical capacity as a vocalist and yet a number of the songs were written exclusively by you. How did you write them, and what did you write them on? What was the writing process like for you?
Riki Michele: First a little backstory. Songwriting is a strange thing for me. I have had a sort of love/hate relationship at times with the process. I prefer to do it for myself but the fact that I’ve always been surrounded by some of my favorite songwriters, and have followed such strong female writers most of my life has inspired but also hindered me. I may have sat on that part of my expression out of fear. Some of it was fear of rejection by those writers close to me, but a lot of it was fear of my own scrutiny. I had an internal bar set for myself that was probably misguided and unrealistic. I’d say I started shedding that fear when I went into the studio with Julian Kindred several years ago, and have grown exponentially since then. I’ve kept a journal on and off, and when the door opened to do this record I had absolutely, well almost absolutely, no fear of putting my life’s experience to music.
I hear melody lines first, then I go and plink it out on the Rhodes and then I usually start singing some nonsense words that lead into a thought or feeling. Then I start scribbling. I usually scribble in note pads. I have to have Bic ball point pens…soft, fat tips on soft paper. I have found paper made of recycled stone that is my favorite; it feels like you’re writing on butter. Then I rewrite and rewrite and scribble out and rewrite and most of the time go back to my first lines. Deadlines are my friends as I will usually wait until almost the last minute, but that’s just how I roll.
One of the songs on the record, “The Sweetness”, I actually wrote in the late ‘90’s, and it was originally about my move from Cali to Nashville during a very dark and painful time where healing and light awaited. Over the years that song has resurfaced and become relevant in different situations and continues to be a force for some reason. I’ve changed it a bit for this record and it’s one of my favorites still. Some of the other songs were written with my producer and friend, Margaret Becker. I would share my concept with her, text her a snippet of me singing into the phone and then we’d Skype with me sitting at the Rhodes and her on her guitar and work it out. Maggie is amazing to write with. She empowers, educates, uplifts and serves. She does not try to take the reins but clears the junk off the pathway so your true self and message can get through. I feel like all the songs on this record say exactly what my heart needed to say.
It also might be fair to say that most people think of you primarily in a musical capacity and yet you are a visual artist and sculptor as well. How do your multiple creative selves coexist and in what ways do they intersect or interact? How do you balance all this and keep your art a priority with holding down the fort as a wife and mother too?
How do I balance it all and be a mom and wife too? Well that is a mighty fine question Ojo and the answer is: POORLY! You know, it baffles me too. I’ve sung since I was able to talk and have always been interested in art, so even though I’ve tried throughout my whole life to just pick one, I can’t do it. It’s like one can’t exist without the other. When I was recording Surround Me, I had just started a soap company with my friend Lisa Michaels and we called it Starlet Lounge. We made soap and bath salts and lip balm. So fun! I remember Julian saying, “Have you ever just done music?” The answer was and still is, “no”. Life would be a lot easier if I could. But as it is, what ends up happening most of the time is that I have a boatload of creative ideas, start a few projects and finish fewer. And I’ve decided that’s okay. I do my best to stay on task and breathe.
After I recorded Surround Me, I got pregnant with my first little human and I took a pottery class out of desperation to keep myself from an incessant quest for something sweet. Lord have mercy I had such a sweet tooth that I NEVER had before pregnancy. Anywho, I was hooked on pottery immediately and have been working with clay now for about 13 years. I have a studio space and a kiln and I try and go there every day and get my hands dirty. I am fortunate, so very fortunate, to be able to follow my creative endeavors and I don’t take a minute of that for granted. It is my job.
I’m taking electric guitar lessons from my friend Joey Harris (The Beat Farmers) and I work that into my day as a part of my job as well. After the kids get home from school is when family time and housework kicks in. And what I’ve discovered at this point in my life is that the housework will always be there. In three short years my first baby human will be driving. DRIVING Joey!!!! It will all get done when it needs to get done, but the main goal is being present with my family, loving my peeps around me and doing good work whether it’s music or pottery. I’ll let you know when I’ve got that down.
Can you talk about your musical evolution, from what I would imagine was a very tough job in having to individuate from all that was Adam Again, to this album and finding your own voice? What were the important milestones along the way?
I feel like I’ve gone through so many transitions, changes and life lessons since my time with Adam Again that all played a part in my musical growth and transformation. Age and experience are really to blame. When I was in Adam Again, I was a very small part of the actual creative process. Most of the time I was fine with that role; sometimes I wasn’t. I was so young though and did not really have the chops to contribute much, or so I felt. Gene was the head of that circus and I was happy swinging on the trapeze….most of the time.
My Adam Again story, as you know, is an intense, emotional and complicated story, but a necessary one, as it was the platform and diving board that I was able to spring from. I learned so many things that I still hold on to. Gene’s writing is amazing, and I’d say he paid a visit or two in my heart when I was writing for this record. I have many other muses and teachers that have been with me from Adam Again until now. My recording experiences with you, The Choir, Terry Taylor, Julian Kindred and my time with my bands in Nashville were all huge milestones and learning experiences for me.
The music I listen to inspires and educates me all the time and ranges from prog rock to trance to dance to tribal. For the last two years or so I’ve been so moved by a band called 1 Giant Leap and their whole recording experience; that played a huge part in my writing. These two guys, Jamie Catto and Duncan Bridgeman, filmed a series called “What About Me” where they took topics like spiritually, abuse, sex, and religion, and interviewed people from all over the world, and also recorded musicians from all over the world on the same songs using those same topics. The outcome is incredible. It’s this compilation of music and interviews that rocked me to my core. It not only spoke to me on a musical level but on a very deep internal and spiritual level. I was deeply inspired.
My ultimate landing on the heart of where I wanted to go with this record was inspired by Maggie. When we had that first writing experience together she encouraged me to get to the heart of me and what I wanted to put out there…to take complete charge of my project and lead it to its proper end. I finally felt like I was collaborating with someone who got my vision and who was joining me, not doing me a favor.
You dedicate this album to your sister. In what ways does the experience of losing her way too early show up in the songs? How has it altered your life perspective and worldview?
Losing my sister is a big one. I think it’s best to tell you how it all went down to make sense of where I am today. We moved from Nashville, where we’d lived for 15 years, to San Diego, and settled right in. My family was ecstatic that we were close again. After about a year and a half Dave lost his job and things became financially difficult for us. We started thinking about going back to Nashville and eventually did. Once we were back and just starting to settle in, we got a call that my sister was really sick. She thought she had the flu. Within a couple of weeks she was diagnosed with colon cancer that had moved into her liver. It seemed like she was fine, then she was fighting for her life in a matter of weeks.
I flew home to Cali a couple of times to be with her. The second time I flew home we were all standing around her bed in the hospital, my parents, my brother, her husband and her three kids, and she quietly left us. Her exit was so peaceful and our reaction was anything but. Being present in her leaving and sharing in that much pain coming from the people I love the most changed me. Changed everything. I am still trying to make sense of how, but a different me came home to Nashville. When I got back Dave knew. We both understood. We had to go back. I had to go home and be near my family. Dave and the kids understood, and there were some compelling reasons for them to want to make the move back as well.
Death and moving are two of the most stressful things a person can go through. We had a death and two moves in less than a year. It was hard. Hard for us to leave, hard to go back, hard for our friends in Nashville, hard all around. But the peace when we got back to San Diego I cannot describe. I don’t know if it was exhaustion or gratitude or brokenness but I cried constantly for days with the overwhelming sense of peace that we were in the right place (enter “The Sweetness”). We were home and close to my family. That experience infused not only my songwriting, but everything.
I try and take nothing for granted. I “love a little harder”, I am more aware of the importance of saying what you mean and meaning what you say. I am better about staying in touch with my family and those close to me. But I am also more fearful of losing another. I’m working on that. My faith has also changed. I have not lost it, but at times I feel I’m just hanging on by a thread. I still feel like I’m being guided and that I’m not alone. I still feel loved and cared for but I am wrestling with the Source and what that truly means to me. I know that was a long answer and a little vague. Like I said, I am still making sense of it all.
Almost all of the songs refer to a “you,” and some of them in a pretty personal and direct way. Is there a single “you” that the songs reference, or multiple specific “you’s” or is it all more generic?
They’re all different “you’s”. In “Into Peace”, the “you” is home, family and friends in San Diego. I wrote it with them and the way they opened their arms to our wounded lot in mind. In “What Would You Say” the “you” is my ego. In “Push” the “you” is sort of a guiding entity or even change itself. In “Balance” the “you” is my intuition, which I believe to be the voice of the creator or the holy spirit. The “you” in “Sweetness” is that very same voice. Did I leave any out?
What is “The Big One?” And I have to ask, who is “Mama?”
That’s a good one. “The Big One” is my favorite song on the record for one. It’s the one that haunts me the most. I started writing it about the fact that I tend to make quick decisions, sometimes big decisions, on the fly, and deal with the consequences later. Most decisions I make turn out all right but some don’t. This song is about a particular decision or even an event that changes your life. At least that is the way I intended it when I first started to write it. However, it hits me deeper and breaks my heart when I hear it so there is more meaning in it for me than I am aware of at this time. It may just be the chord changes and the BGV’s, which I love so dearly, and have MC Maggie B (Margaret Becker) to thank for that. She’s a genius. It may be images I get of my family and the feeling of heartbreak. It may revolve around a bunch of moments for me, stirring up emotions. Whatever it is, I’m grateful for it.
“Hey Mama” is my second favorite! I wrote it at an all-girls, mostly all artist, “chick camp” weekend last year. We were given a topic when we got there on Friday and were asked to write a song, a poem or even a rap around that topic and we could perform it on Saturday night if we so desired. The topic was “Harvest”. I wrote it with all the women in my life in mind. Mama is my own mom, my sister, my best friends. I have been blessed with some incredibly strong women in my life who have guided me and given me my voice in so many ways. It’s an homage to all those women. On Saturday night of Chick Camp I taught the women the “Hey Mama” line and had them harmonize it. Here we are, outside under the stars and I have about 60 girls singing this line over and over at me and I sang the melody over them. It was a magical moment for me. I had tears streaming down my face. It was a dream. When I recorded the song in the studio it was a similar experience. I got some of my dearest friends in the studio with me and had them sing the “Hey Mama Hey” part. They harmonized, clapped and even vamped at the end and we got it all. I tear up now EVERY TIME I hear it.
There are a number of apparent contradictions or dichotomies in “What Would You Say,” from the second line in each verse (“I’m not completely convinced that it’s true”) walking back the line right before it to the chorus itself (“Let it go, or hold on”). Can you talk about this?
Like I said earlier, that song is a conversation I’m having with my ego. I was thinking a lot about the power of the ego and what would it be like if I could totally move through life without it. Could we survive without it? Isn’t it necessary in some areas? Doesn’t it drive us at times and doesn’t it totally screw up everything at times? It’s meant to be a playful take on those questions.
What is it about the song “Push” that led to your choosing it as the title of the record? In what ways is that song the “thesis statement,” if you will allow the professor in me to ask?
Well Professor Ojo, that is a mighty fine question once again. There’s a line in the song sung by the fabulous Joe Alexander that says, “Here comes the stinger….here comes the PUSH”. In that song the Push is that “guiding entity” that I mentioned earlier. I found that there were a lot of these moments in my life around writing for and leading up to making this record. It’s a strong word and what it means to me is that I was guided, I pushed through it and I’m pushing forward.
Why Nashville, and how did you assemble this crew? Did you rehearse ahead of time or mostly work things out in the studio? How long were you there, or did it involve multiple trips out for your home in San Diego?
Oh I love this part of the story! My friend Tiffany called me on a Wednesday one day last year and said it would be so wonderful if I could fly to Nashville and surprise our dear friend Marie McGilvray for her 50th birthday. I told her maybe if I could book my ticket a couple weeks in advance and had the dough, blah, blah, blah. She said, “Well, it’s actually this Saturday.” I laughed and said no way would Dave be into it, but I told her to call him and try and butter him up. We’re all great friends you see. I’m not sure what she said to him but he told me that if I could turn it into a song-writing trip then it would be worth trying to make it happen. Not that our lovely Marie wasn’t enough, ha ha.
So I called a bunch of peeps to see if they wanted to write together. That’s embarrassing for me. The people I called are kind of big cheeses and I was nervous to put myself out there. Well, the ones who bit were the biggest cheeses of all…Margaret Becker and Ric Cua for cryin’ out loud! I had just met Ric and thought he was the nicest guy in the universe. So, I flew to Nashville, surprised lovely Marie and went to Maggie’s and then Ric’s. I was so nervous on my way to Maggie’s, I was shaking like a flippin’ Chihuahua. Maggie welcomed me into her home like I was her bff. She noticed I was nervous and put me right at ease. We proceeded to write a really nice song together, and in the process started talking about my being ready to make a record. A week later, I asked her if she would produce and she said yes! We started writing and plotting and as soon as we raised the dough the rest is history.
It made so much sense to choose Nashville as I feel at home there. I have my old band mates Jerry Roe and Robbie Cureton there, and some of my best friends live there. What better way to record the first record in years! The way we assembled our players just kind of fell into place. I wanted Jerry and Robbie for sure, if they were available, because we were once in a band together and they both are amazing musicians. Maggie told me about Stephen Leiweke and Matt Stanfield and come to find out, they all had crossed each other’s paths at one time or another in the studio and liked one another so it was perfect. The rest of the musicians that contributed are all friends and people we love. I could not imagine this record without any one of them.
When it came time to record, there was no rehearsing. Maggie and I had a lot of Skyping for writing and planning, and then two days of preproduction with Stephen and Matt before the rest of the band came in. We recorded the whole kit and caboodle in about 10 days with Maggie and Stephen laying down a few more tracks after I left. I was only there for those 10 days. A whirlwind of a trip.
Amanda Palmer talks about her crowd-funding experience in very personal and vulnerable ways. Can you talk about what it was like for you to “put yourself out there” that way, to in a sense, as Amanda would say, not “get” people to support you but to “let” them do so? What was it like for you?
I was against it at first because I didn’t fully understand it. It was embarrassing to me to have to ask people for money. But seeing so many of our friends’ bands do it and talk to them about the experience started to change my point of view a bit. That and the fact that I had already supported a bunch of crowd-funding projects; I did that because I believed in them and wanted to be a part of them, and that made me feel okay about doing my own. Once we got into, I was amazed at how it really does connect you to the people who believe in you. I was beyond surprised, grateful and completely humbled by the experience. I made new friends and am anxious to give them this music that they helped me make.
Are you planning on performing these songs? How will you work that out logistically with performers?
UGH! I don’t know. Yes, I mean YES! I want to do it all. Here’s my plan: I want to find a programming / computer geek musician, an amazing bass player and a percussionist and go all over town and play my heart out. That’s what I want. Check in with me in about 6 months to see how this is panning out.
What’s next musically?
Well I’m continuing with my guitar lessons and have the writing bug, so I’m continuing with that as well. Pushing forward, singing these songs, making new ones and getting my hands dirty. That’s what’s next hopefully.
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